Chapter 5 — Interviews

National schools

The Investigation Committee examined in detail the career of one teacher, Mr John Brander1, who had physically and sexually abused children in national and secondary schools for over 40 years. The report into Mr John Brander is outlined in full in Volume II of this Report and covers many of the circumstances of abuse outlined by interviewees to the Commission.

Interviews were conducted in respect of 63 national schools that were situated all over the country. These schools were owned and managed by the diocese in which they were located or by religious congregations. They were operated by lay teachers or religious or both. Interviewees spoke of experiences of physical, sexual and emotional abuse whilst attending school, principally at the hands of teachers.

Of the 63 national schools mentioned by complainants, 52 were each the subject of one allegation. Nine were the subject of two allegations. Two schools were the subject of more than two allegations of abuse; one had five past pupils who made allegations of abuse and one had 10 past pupils making such allegations.

Sixty-nine interviewees were male and 16 were female.

Over 95 percent of the adult male interviewees complained of physical abuse by one or more teachers during their school days. These complainants acknowledged that corporal punishment was the practice at the time in national schools and were quite clear on the difference between ordinary physical chastisement and abusive and excessive beatings. Although there were some allegations against lay teachers and nuns, the overwhelming majority of complaints were against religious teaching Brothers.

Complainants appeared to have been most frightened and most damaged by teachers who lost control of their tempers. One Brother was described as beating ‘in a frenzy’. Another was described as ‘losing it completely’ and yet another as ‘frothing at the mouth’ during a beating. Where teachers lost control in this way, the children were subjected to extreme and excessive punishments. Beatings were administered with leathers, sticks and other such implements and were on all parts of the bodies. Boys were punched and kicked and terrorised for long periods. In some schools boys were required to drop their trousers and receive strokes of the leather or cane on the bare buttocks. These beatings were most frequently a response to a failure at lessons rather than any misbehaviour on the part of the child.

Interviewees reported seeing children bleeding and bruised after such beatings. Actual physical harm was also reported, such as the loss of teeth or being knocked unconscious, although doctors or parents were usually not told the real cause of the injury.

Extreme and excessive beatings administered regularly in the classroom had a negative impact, not just on the child who was the victim of the beating but on all the children in the classroom and those within earshot. Interviewees said that the pain, anger and humiliation caused by excessive beatings prevented them from learning properly at school. Many reported leaving school at 13 years of age with a very low standard of education.

It was frequently observed by complainants that not all pupils were treated the same way by violent teachers. This indicated that although there was a lack of control there was also awareness on the part of the teacher that beating some children would cause more trouble and they were able to control their violence in respect of these children.

Brothers or teachers who were violent were known within the school system .Interviewees often singled out two or even three Brothers in the same school who were excessively harsh on pupils and could often name other Brothers who were kind and good. It was regarded by interviewees as significant that Brothers who themselves did not operate a violent regime, tolerated and/or ignored violence in their fellow teachers. This was particularly marked where the principal of a school had a violent disposition. In those instances the children felt hopeless and isolated in the face of the cruelty they experienced whilst in school.

The majority of interviewees said that they did not speak to their parents about what was occurring in the classroom. They believed that their parents would not support them and that it would make matters worse when they returned to class. Some parents did appear to regard severe beatings as a normal part of school life; as one said: ‘sure we all got beaten’.

Some children did speak to their parents and where parents intervened there was some evidence that this reduced the violence the child was subsequently subjected to. In general, however, parents appeared to be as helpless and intimidated by the teachers as the child was. Many witnesses indicated an awareness of the helplessness of their parents and said they kept the suffering to themselves rather than worry and upset their parents who they believed could have done nothing about it anyway.

In addition to information about excessive and violent teachers, interviewees also spoke of the constant and pervasive presence of high levels of physical punishment in classrooms. The strap or the cane was used extensively and was the response to even minor infractions. Many complainants identified this as a significant factor in preventing them from succeeding academically. They said they were paralysed with fear and incapable of absorbing information or of learning school work.

Interviewees were able to distinguish teachers who used excessive punishment from those who did not. Teachers who behaved in a moderate, controlled non-threatening manner were singled out as being better teachers and interviewees reported learning much more in classes where violence was not a feature. Even if a child encountered only one or two benign and kindly teachers in the course of their national school education, this was often enough to give them a basic foundation in education and they recalled those teachers with gratitude.

A number of male interviewees were in national schools run by female Religious Orders until the ages of six or seven after which they moved to boys-only schools. Although in general experiences in very young classes were better than in older classes, a significant number of interviewees described extremely harsh and excessive physical punishment on very young children. Nuns and teachers were described as using leathers, canes, sally rods2 and heavy rulers on children as young as three and four. Where children were treated with cruelty at such an early age, their ability to advance in school was greatly impaired.